We apologise...

[ldcdc]

Did anyone notice how hard it is for so many people and companies to assume guilt, say I'm sorry and apologise?

Both in my direct encounters with providers and by following discussions between hosts and their customers, it has always struck me as strange that even though the customer is right, and sometimes the host admits this, the words "we apologise" seem come about very rarely.

I wonder why. Why the reluctance to honestly admit guilt? Why the lack of (what are IMO) basic manners? Why this... persisting arrogance?

The other thing I've noticed are the "fake" apologies, that usually are made to sound almost like "we apologise, but you should in fact be the one apologising to us".

Anyway, I really can't imagine what a company has to gain from refraining to say "We apologise." Do you have any ideas?

[crislem]

Oh yes, you said it right. I think this "We apologize" thing happened in the same time with the disappearance of "Thank you!"

This could be hapenning because of the fact that everybody is so busy these days and nobody has time for "such things". I will refer to hosting now, not a generalization, mainly just an observation. When a company is just starting things and they have no or very few customers, the staff tends to do its best to keep happy the people that are interested in their services. They provide polite, comprehensive messages.

After a while, when they grow and become very busy, some tend to forget about the way they were and thus short messages are not so time consuming and they become essential.

I am aware of the fact that I didn't talk only about what you wanted to, sorry about that, I'll go back to the topic of discussion.

What I said above is connected somewhat to what I am about to say. The fact that a company is big makes some of them somehow think that they don't rely on one customer, they can do very well with or without him. That leaves room to satisfying the ego and not bow your head to say "I apologize". It could also be because of the time those few words take to say, I don't know...

If the small companies do that, they do it out of total lack of experience and show their muscles way too early in the process. In both cases, just like you said, it is a matter of basic manners.

So, my final answer is this: They can only gain some time. I can't think of anything else, I don't see anything good that could come as result from such behaviour, even though it is used. Maybe somebody that uses it could help us out.

I want to say it again, not everybody is like that. I talked to somebody important in the hosting business and received a fast, nice answer, so there are still good guys out there. I experienced the opposite of that too.

[ldcdc]

Oh, yes, "Thank you!" is yet another matter.

Maybe both come out of the providers' wrong impression that "We're sorry", "We apologise" and even "Thank you" somehow make them lose a part of their "prestige aura". I mean, here we are, one big succesful company, almost begging for mercy. That just can't happen!

[crislem]

Well, it's kind of like that. I sat and thought about the fact that a "simple" customer can't do very much about it. I mean, if you are satisfied with a company's services and they mess something up, something minor, and in the end they don't say "We apologize", what can you do? You can't move from them because of that. You might end up with some other company that says "we're sorry" A LOT. (if you get what I mean) And the companies know that customers' fear.

In the same time, if nobody's going to be cranky about this, we will end up living in a society that doesn't have those words in the vocabulary (I'm exaggerating, I know , but I do it to make my point)

To draw them attention about this matter would be considered impolite from your side so... Hmm... I guess in the end it has to be something that comes from inside and if some people don't have it... I don't know what a customer should do.

[ldcdc]

You made very good points, there's nothing a customer can do about it without being rude. But maybe I'm just behind the times, and I overrate the role of apologies.

Do they weigh as much as they used to? How much do they weigh for you? Maybe in todays world they don't mean as much as they used to, and that's why they're neglected. However, in a world where they seem to become rarer, one would think they would become more valued. Sort of like diamonds.

[crislem]

However, in a world where they seem to become rarer, one would think they would become more valued. Sort of like diamonds.

Exactly! Don't you find yourself saying sometimes "Did you see how nice I was treated?" as if it is something you wouldn't normally deserve?

Because employers couldn't determine their employees to be polite, they invented "employee of the month" so if politeness is hidden somewhere in you, maybe it can be dug out if some money is involved.

Apologies matter to me and as far as I know they always did. I want to think I don't feel this just because I rarely hear them. I wouldn't mind if they were used more, that's for sure. (not talking only about hosting industry, but public institutions as well)

[ldcdc]

Because employers couldn't determine their employees to be polite, they invented "employee of the month" so if politeness is hidden somewhere in you, maybe it can be dug out if some money is involved.

That's a good point. Maybe it is not the owners, but the employees who don't have the right attitude, in which case the employers should probably take more time to review the way the staff interacts with the customers.

After all, I find it hard to believe that a company would actually have "Don't say I'm sorry!" as an active policy.

[crislem]

I concur, but what I think most employers focus on are the things the "new guy" knows to do, not the way he talks to the customer...

Do you want to be my partner in this new project of mine? A "Politeness test" used when people apply for a job.

[ldcdc]

I concur, but what I think most employers focus on are the things the "new guy" knows to do, not the way he talks to the customer...

Do you want to be my partner in this new project of mine? A "Politeness test" used when people apply for a job.

That might work if you hire a tech that never or rarely has to speak to a customer. He just tinkers with whatever his job requires him/her to, and exits the door at 5:00PM.

When the employee is your company's face, there must be a somewhat more thorough "personality test" there IMO.

[crislem]

True, yeah, I didn't cover that part.

I think what you said happens in most companies, but the employees' behaviour could change in time=> the person who was nice and smiling 2 months ago, is now a grumpy person. I don't know, can such a person be fired based on that?

[ldcdc]

True, yeah, I didn't cover that part.

I think what you said happens in most companies, but the employees' behaviour could change in time=> the person who was nice and smiling 2 months ago, is now a grumpy person. I don't know, can such a person be fired based on that?

I think the answer is yes, since the wrong attitude can lead to lost customers and/or less/no sales, and when that happens, it can pave the way to bankruptcy.

A grumpy employee, might be the doing of management though. Overworking, setting impossible goals, not paying enough, all can be causes for employee unhappyness. if this is the case, then the company itself needs a bit of reform.

Do you think that the trend we're discussion is caused by the employees' attitudes or by management's attitude towards their employess and the business itself? Where is the root of evil?

[crislem]

Do you think that the trend we're discussion is caused by the employees' attitudes or by management's attitude towards their employess and the business itself?

Hmm, good question. The way things usually are in life, I think it is not either black or white, but grey. The balance tends to lean more on the employees side though (this meaning I think it is more their fault) because often times the working conditions (environment, payment that the employee agreed with, etc) remain the same and managment does its best to keep it that way. Even so, some people become lazy because they are bored to do the same things day after day and in time this boredom causes the troubles.

You said that employees can be fired for being grumpy. Okay, I accept that. But I didn't complain about an employee ever in my life even though I felt like doing it quite some times. If everybody is like me, how will the manager find out? Do you make complaints?

[pvthosting]

Did anyone notice how hard it is for so many people and companies to assume guilt, say I'm sorry and apologise?

I wonder why. Why the reluctance to honestly admit guilt? Why the lack of (what are IMO) basic manners? Why this... persisting arrogance?

sometimes it's caused by being rushed. Other people are just rude. It's like going out to eat. You might get there on a slow night and the server has plenty of time to take care of everything or you might get there on a busy night and the server barely has time to take your order.  Or you just end up with a rude server.

But it's not my fault as the customer that I went to the restaurant when they were busy. The manager should have prepared for the busy night and been properly staffed. If I go somewhere that is too busy to take care of me I assume they don't need me as a customer so I go elsewhere.

Hosting company's should be the same way. If they are getting to large to promptly give all customers a detailed response and the manners that the customer expect then they need to expand. Otherwise the customer's will go elsewhere.

I do everything I can to give my customer's a kind reply to everything. I thank them for their business in just about every communication I send out. If there is a problem I admit it's a problem and give them an estimate on how long it will take to resolve. I will respond with "sorry for any inconvenience" and "thank you for your patience"

I know that if my customers feel unappreciate or that I can't take care of their needs that they will go to another hosts. Just like there are plenty of restaurants around there are plenty of hosts around.

again just my 2 cents

[crislem]

Yeah, hosting companies should know it is an important thing and they should make sure they apply it (politeness with their customers)